The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

[pearlbeer]

High risk and disappointing for sure. But riskiest possible? That sounds like a perfect Democratic debate, i.e. one that is likely to end up resembling a circular firing squad, lol. Depending on how ornery I'm feeling I could argue that in several ways. Here's a mostly conservative take: the current Democratic Party may be the closest thing to a "big tent" that this country has ever seen. As such nobody can confidently predict where the heart (or center or most votes if you prefer) actually is at any given time nor which candidate might be the most appealing at any given time. In fact, it's too bad the elephant is the Republican symbol because the old saw about "it depends upon which part of the elephant you're touching" seems pretty applicable. "Which part of the donkey" just doesn't have the same je ne sais quoi.

Maybe I was being a bit hyperbolic, but Biden is a risky choice for sure. In (another) must win election. Do policy positions really matter? It's pretty much a 'oh God, please, please don't let it be Trump' election at this point.

You know who would win? Think about it before you laugh or judge me. If it's just about about the win..Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson. Can you smell what America is cooking? It would work.

He would whip both donkey & elephant candy asses!

[beantownbubba]

Do policy positions really matter? It's pretty much a 'oh God, please, please don't let it be Trump' election at this point.

This is the absolute bottom line truth. Its most immediate application per this morning's NYT poll is to pro-Palestinians who claim that they will not vote for Biden* on that basis alone. IMHO this is nuts. Does anybody actually think that Trump will be better for Gazans or Palestinians generally, chances for peace or chances for a Palestinian country (2 state solution or otherwise)? Yet according to the poll (and others)...

*For this purpose remember that non-voting (if the voter would normally have voted for Biden) is just about as bad as voting for Trump.

[beantownbubba]

Maybe I was being a bit hyperbolic

We're all entitled to a little hyperbole and normally I wouldn't make any kind of deal about it. But in the context of this election where pretty much every breath or sneeze is blown out of proportion by somebody, hyperbole tends to reinforce the most negative narratives out there. In this case calling Biden a risky choice is acknowledging reality but calling him the riskiest gives credence to the "he's too old" drumbeat.

[brettac1]

Do policy positions really matter? It's pretty much a 'oh God, please, please don't let it be Trump' election at this point.

This is the absolute bottom line truth. Its most immediate application per this morning's NYT poll is to pro-Palestinians who claim that they will not vote for Biden* on that basis alone. IMHO this is nuts. Does anybody actually think that Trump will be better for Gazans or Palestinians generally, chances for peace or chances for a Palestinian country (2 state solution or otherwise)? Yet according to the poll (and others)...

*For this purpose remember that non-voting (if the voter would normally have voted for Biden) is just about as bad as voting for Trump.

I'm obviously extremely dissatisfied with Biden's handling of Israel/Gaza but being in one of *the* swing states, I don't feel I have any choice but to vote for him. If I lived in a non-competitive state I would likely be open to not voting for him but for the fact there is not really another non-Trump candidate that I would take seriously. I guess I'd just leave that line blank if it got to that point.

I would also point out that he has time to change his policies on this issue to meet more of his potential voters where they are at. No one that I talk about this with would ever consider voting for Trump so I'm very skeptical of anyone who voted for Biden in the past legitimately doing that.

[pearlbeer]

Maybe I was being a bit hyperbolic

We're all entitled to a little hyperbole and normally I wouldn't make any kind of deal about it. But in the context of this election where pretty much every breath or sneeze is blown out of proportion by somebody, hyperbole tends to reinforce the most negative narratives out there. In this case calling Biden a risky choice is acknowledging reality but calling him the riskiest gives credence to the "he's too old" drumbeat.

Interesting listen today on the NYT Daily Podcast. TLDR: Most of the electorate is dissatisfied and wants some sort of 'major change' in the country. Trump certainly represents *change*, where Biden does not. This could explain some of the shocking early polling.

Biden, IMHO has been a fine President. A good one even. During some tough times. There is no doubt that he has brought stability to a deeply unstable situation. I have no doubts about his ability, authenticity and morality. He is the candidate and will have my vote and financial support.

That said, a few things are true. Deserved or not, fair or not, right or wrong.

1) He is deeply unpopular and hasn't been able to consistently reverse the numbers.
2) Just like Hillary, opinions of him been compromised to a good chunk of the electorate by the right (Hunter, age, gaffes, etc).
3) He isn't a particularly inspiring speaker, in a time where it seems like we need one.
4) He's too old (sorry btb). So is Trump. Look, I'm not being a jerk and saying he is too old to do, succeed or complete the job, but he's old. He looks old, talks old (stop saying "folks"!), walks old. I'm firm GenX - we're going to get fucked just like always and never have someone of our generation as President. It's time to pass the torch. It's time to train new leadership, on the job if needed. Today's problems need to be tackled by people who were raised within them.

Again, I have a favorable opinion of Biden and will support him. But, hyperbole aside, if you agree with at least most of my above points, a better candidate should have been chosen. Especially if the raw victory is the most important factor. It drives me crazy to hear the media reporting about how "both candidates are flawed", the electorate is "uninspired and depressed" by the rematch. These, to me, seem like issues that can be, at least somewhat, addressed. The Republicans seem to be stuck with their candidate and the Democrats just seem determined to stick by theirs, risk and facts be damned.

[beantownbubba]

Maybe I was being a bit hyperbolic

We're all entitled to a little hyperbole and normally I wouldn't make any kind of deal about it. But in the context of this election where pretty much every breath or sneeze is blown out of proportion by somebody, hyperbole tends to reinforce the most negative narratives out there. In this case calling Biden a risky choice is acknowledging reality but calling him the riskiest gives credence to the "he's too old" drumbeat.

Interesting listen today on the NYT Daily Podcast. TLDR: Most of the electorate is dissatisfied and wants some sort of 'major change' in the country. Trump certainly represents *change*, where Biden does not. This could explain some of the shocking early polling.

Biden, IMHO has been a fine President. A good one even. During some tough times. There is no doubt that he has brought stability to a deeply unstable situation. I have no doubts about his ability, authenticity and morality. He is the candidate and will have my vote and financial support.

That said, a few things are true. Deserved or not, fair or not, right or wrong.

1) He is deeply unpopular and hasn't been able to consistently reverse the numbers.
2) Just like Hillary, opinions of him been compromised to a good chunk of the electorate by the right (Hunter, age, gaffes, etc).
3) He isn't a particularly inspiring speaker, in a time where it seems like we need one.
4) He's too old (sorry btb). So is Trump. Look, I'm not being a jerk and saying he is too old to do, succeed or complete the job, but he's old. He looks old, talks old (stop saying "folks"!), walks old. I'm firm GenX - we're going to get fucked just like always and never have someone of our generation as President. It's time to pass the torch. It's time to train new leadership, on the job if needed. Today's problems need to be tackled by people who were raised within them.

Again, I have a favorable opinion of Biden and will support him. But, hyperbole aside, if you agree with at least most of my above points, a better candidate should have been chosen. Especially if the raw victory is the most important factor. It drives me crazy to hear the media reporting about how "both candidates are flawed", the electorate is "uninspired and depressed" by the rematch. These, to me, seem like issues that can be, at least somewhat, addressed. The Republicans seem to be stuck with their candidate and the Democrats just seem determined to stick by theirs, risk and facts be damned.

I agree with virtually all of that. I guess my point of departure is that I've gone a little further down the road of accepting that Biden will indeed be the candidate and since that ship has sailed harping on (or hyperbolizing) all that is wrong with him just doesn't help. The fact that virtually nobody had any say in the matter, that Biden just was so he is and will be without any input from the electorate is frustrating to say the least and the "process" or lack thereof was wrong in many important ways, but again we're past the point of no return.

Trump as the candidate of change just blows my mind. You make an important point that it doesn't matter if it's true if it's what many people believe, but I have a very hard time understanding that.

[beantownbubba]

Do policy positions really matter? It's pretty much a 'oh God, please, please don't let it be Trump' election at this point.

This is the absolute bottom line truth. Its most immediate application per this morning's NYT poll is to pro-Palestinians who claim that they will not vote for Biden* on that basis alone. IMHO this is nuts. Does anybody actually think that Trump will be better for Gazans or Palestinians generally, chances for peace or chances for a Palestinian country (2 state solution or otherwise)? Yet according to the poll (and others)...

*For this purpose remember that non-voting (if the voter would normally have voted for Biden) is just about as bad as voting for Trump.

I'm obviously extremely dissatisfied with Biden's handling of Israel/Gaza but being in one of *the* swing states, I don't feel I have any choice but to vote for him. If I lived in a non-competitive state I would likely be open to not voting for him but for the fact there is not really another non-Trump candidate that I would take seriously. I guess I'd just leave that line blank if it got to that point.

I would also point out that he has time to change his policies on this issue to meet more of his potential voters where they are at. No one that I talk about this with would ever consider voting for Trump so I'm very skeptical of anyone who voted for Biden in the past legitimately doing that.

I appreciate this post and your thoughts on the subject. And I assume you will not be surprised that I'm glad you come out where you do.

The only thing that disappoints me just a little is that while it's true that Biden has time to change his policies on Israel/Gaza to better reflect the views of many of the people he represents, I think that Biden has by the standards of international diplomacy/the conduct of foreign affairs already moved a fair bit without getting any credit for it. I get that the point is that he hasn't moved far enough and that's certainly a reasonable position but it seems from the very far distance at which I view these events that we're stuck in that old loop where to admit that the other side has done anything right is to undercut one's own position for sure and maybe the position/status/potency of that position or that "side.".

That's not in any way directed at you personally it's a response to the "yeah but too little too late" type responses that I've see from pro-Palestinian leaders on a regular basis.as Biden has, at least from my perspective continued to move in their direction.

[tinnitus photography]

I agree with virtually all of that. I guess my point of departure is that I've gone a little further down the road of accepting that Biden will indeed be the candidate and since that ship has sailed harping on (or hyperbolizing) all that is wrong with him just doesn't help. The fact that virtually nobody had any say in the matter, that Biden just was so he is and will be without any input from the electorate is frustrating to say the least and the "process" or lack thereof was wrong in many important ways, but again we're past the point of no return.

this speaks volumes to the root of voter dissatisfaction and apathy.

[beantownbubba]

this speaks volumes to the root of voter dissatisfaction and apathy.

I totally understand voter dissatisfaction and while I get the apathy, imho voter apathy in any election but especially in this one is just not an option. As a general matter and not directed at you or anyone personally, to the extent that voter apathy leads to disengagement from the process and to not voting it is self-indulgent, irresponsible and an unacceptable response to a bad situation or bad outcome. While I'm sure plenty of people would disagree with me w/ respect to this election where 3rd party voting may be especially dangerous, I would say that even voting third party or being moved to start a new party more reflective of and responsive to one's views is a better option than not voting.

FWIW, I have been struggling with the lack of appealing voting choices my entire voting age life, sometimes w/ more distaste or revulsion, sometimes less. But I do my best to make what I consider to be the best choice given all the outcomes and intended and unintended consequences I can imagine and then I vote. I don't see that there's any other option. In terms of this cycle, I had assumed from before Biden's election in 2020 that he would by intention be a one term president and I was surprised when he chose to run again. And when he chose to run I was disappointed that there was barely a ripple in terms of intra-party opposition. Biden would not have been my first or even second choice this election season had there been an opportunity to register my preferences. But either Trump or Biden is going to be president for the next 4 years and I can't imagine not weighing in on that choice.

[tinnitus photography]

this bit from Chris Rock sums it up (jump to this if you don't want to watch the whole thing):

https://youtu.be/J8TqhBIEbWA?si=KvpTTVaz9boD7KWm&t=224

[brettac1]

https://www.propublica.org/article/texa ... dium=email

[beantownbubba]

https://www.propublica.org/article/texa ... dium=email

Very interesting, mostly for its rarity and partly as a heartening example of individual evolution.

[beantownbubba]

My favorite whipping boy is back in the news, so I can't resist. From the WaPo (emphasis added):

Scorching temperatures set numerous records across South Florida on Wednesday, and historically hot conditions for mid-May will persist through the weekend.

On Wednesday, Key West experienced a particularly brutal combination of heat and humidity, registering a heat index of 115 — matching the highest mark on record for any time of year.

The record heat comes after Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) on Wednesday signed a bill scrubbing most references to climate change from state law. Critics say the measure, which will take effect July 1, ignores the threats Florida faces from extreme heat as well as powerful hurricanes and worsening toxic algae blooms.

Although South Florida is accustomed to warm, humid weather much of the year, this brutal combination of heat and humidity has little precedent in May.

[beantownbubba]

The race to the bottom among Ron DeSantis, Greg Abbott and JD Vance* may have finally been definitively won (lost?). At least I hope the bar can't be lowered any further. Governor Abbott's pardon of a racist, murdering POS for no good or even arguable legal, ethical or moral reason makes me want to gag. I have stopped reading about the pardon because I just can't deal with it anymore. This was pure performance for, or maybe signaling to, or maybe both, to the basest part of his base. I can't even imagine being the victim's survivors or, hell, even being a member of the jury that did the right thing and reached the right result only to have the rug pulled out from under them and doubts cast on their character and intelligence. Disgusting.

*The dregs like Gaetz, Greene and Tuberville don't even qualify for the race.